Nonprofit Nation with Julia Campbell

The Unavoidable Power of Facebook Fundraising with Nick Burne

October 27, 2021 Julia Campbell Season 1 Episode 12
Nonprofit Nation with Julia Campbell
The Unavoidable Power of Facebook Fundraising with Nick Burne
Show Notes Transcript

GivePanel is the lead sponsor of the Nonprofit Social Media Summit! Click here to get your ticket -  it's all virtual on November 2-3, 2021.

Despite what you may think of Facebook's ethical practices, nonprofits around the world rely on the social network to connect with donors and raise money every day.  

  • Over $5 billion has been raised with Facebook birthday fundraisers.  
  • Facebook Challenges have raised more than $50 million for nonprofits in the last 12 months alone.
  • 84% of Facebook users share to show their support for a cause and highlight issues that are important to them.

There is overwhelming evidence that nonprofits of all sizes can make a serious impact and raise real money on Facebook (and Instagram). So why is there still so little actionable data on how to do it effectively? 

In this episode, I ask Facebook fundraising expert Nick Burne about the power and potential of Facebook & Instagram fundraising. Nick is the Founder & CEO of GivePanel - a platform that helps over 200 nonprofits manage their Facebook Fundraising (and helps them acquire the donor data). 

Here are some of the topics we discussed:

  • The Facebook Fundraising Benchmarks Report
  • Which causes are seeing the highest growth in Facebook fundraiser income
  • How to use Facebook Group Challenges to raise money and engage your community
  • The biggest mistakes nonprofits make when attempting to raise money on Facebook 

A Nick Burne quotable: "Fundraising is about people and about human beings. So our philosophy is what we call the H two H - human to human. Fundraising is a human thing... I don't see supporters as data. I see supporters as people you can have a relationship with."

Connect with Nick:
https://givepanel.com/blog/
https://twitter.com/nickburne
https://www.linkedin.com/in/nickburne/ 

Do me a favor? Rate, Review, & Follow on Apple Podcasts (or your podcast player of choice) - it helps this podcast get seen by more people that would enjoy it!

About Julia Campbell, the host of the Nonprofit Nation podcast:

Named as a top thought leader by Forbes and BizTech Magazine, Julia Campbell (she/hers) is an author, coach, and speaker on a mission to make the digital world a better place. 

She wrote her book, Storytelling in the Digital Age: A Guide for Nonprofits, as a roadmap for social change agents who want to build movements using engaging digital storytelling techniques. Her second book, How to Build and Mobilize a Social Media Community for Your Nonprofit, was published in 2020 as a call-to-arms for mission-driven organizations to use the power of social media to build movements. Julia’s online courses, webinars, and talks have helped hundreds of nonprofits make the shift to digital thinking and raise more mone

Take my free masterclass: 3 Must-Have Elements of Social Media Content that Converts

Julia Campbell:

Hello, and welcome to nonprofit nation. I'm your host, Julia Campbell. And I'm going to sit down with nonprofit industry experts, fundraisers, marketers, and everyone in between to get real and discuss what it takes to build that movement that you've been dreaming of. I created the nonprofit nation podcast to share practical wisdom and strategies to help you confidently find your voice. definitively grow your audience and effectively build your movement. If you're a nonprofit newbie, or an experienced professional, who's looking to get more visibility, reach more people and create even more impact, then you're in the right place. Let's get started. All right. Hi, everyone. Welcome back. Welcome, again to another episode of nonprofit nation. I'm your host, Julia Campbell. I'm here with my friend from across the pond, Nick burn. He's the founder and CEO of give panel, a platform that helps over 200 nonprofits manage their Facebook, fundraising, something that I know, my listeners are very eager to learn more about. Nick has worked in online fundraising since 2005, developing digital fundraising strategies, which have generated over a billion dollars in donations for organizations like UNICEF, Movember, and Greenpeace. And he just told me to give panel has helped nonprofits raise $43 million in Facebook challenges, which I know we'll cover today. So welcome, Nick. I'm happy to have you

Nick Burne:

all thanks, dude. It's so great to be doing this with you. And yeah, it's been great to, you know, get to know you over the past couple of years. And finally, we're doing this together, which is awesome.

Julia Campbell:

Yes. I was thinking about when we first met, was it the nonprofit Technology Conference?

Nick Burne:

Yeah, we did that. And there was something before that. I can't remember. But you know, you host a great group on Facebook. And I think I was kind of tracking what you're doing and obviously being in the same space. So yeah, it's great. It's great to great to be here on your on your podcast.

Julia Campbell:

Let's begin with your story. What led you to work with nonprofits?

Nick Burne:

Yeah. So I mean, as you said, in the bio, I've been around for a while. So I got into online marketing in the early days, when I was really young, you know, building websites for companies doing SEO, doing email marketing, like back in the day, like this is kind of like last millennium. Like pre 2000. Yeah. And then like one thing, or another long story, but ended up kind of working the music industry, my space time, kind of building fan bases for some bands, and then fell out with the music industry in a big way. And went to kind of work with nonprofits after that, wow, that basically doing the same thing, right, like building fan bases, but this time for kind of nonprofits. So that was fun. That was kind of back in 2005. And I've just been doing online, online fundraising ever since really. So Facebook obviously came around, I remember when it kind of first came out and that kind of thing, and then track that and and really, really started to get deep into Facebook advertising. Like in the early days, I've always thought as a digital fundraiser that digital fundraising follows ecommerce trends. So I've kind of, you know, I've always looked at ecommerce ahead, if you want to see what's happening with online fundraising in the next three years, look at what's happening with e commerce, right?

Julia Campbell:

Absolutely. Oh, I think that's really a great point. I always encourage people to do that when they're looking at online giving statistics, because it seems like such a small percentage, but when in the US at least, but when you look at e commerce, it really the trends really parallel each other.

Nick Burne:

Right. And so I was like, I was building like iPhone apps like back in the day like kind of 2010 11 that kind of like really first generation stuff and, and then ecommerce started to go mobile and social studies to go mobile. And then you could kind of just see the advertising taking off. And then advertising. I remember people telling me like Facebook ads will never work for fundraising. And I was working a lot with UNICEF at the time globally. And we were tracking stuff. And we could see that it was starting to work for emergency fundraising. And you know, so I got into Facebook ads big time, started a accelerator program for nonprofits back in 2016, something like that. And we trained some of the largest nonprofits who spend the most now on Facebook ads. So it really worked hard to scale Facebook ads for fundraising. So the biggest organization in the US that spends the most money, they were a client. And so we ended up spending, you know, multiple, multiple millions of pounds in Facebook ads, but generating a lot of donations for for organizations. Yeah, so so really like online marketing guy, Facebook ads guy. And then when Facebook fundraising came out, it was like all of our clients who were doing Facebook ads were like, Whoa, we're getting all this money from birthday ads, buy from birthday fundraising. What do we do and we were like, We jumped on it really and we started to understand that You know, the lack of data from Facebook fundraising and stuff like that. And we were, we just started working on solutions to help them get more data from Facebook, because it's too big an opportunity, right? Like we have clients that are paying hundreds of dollars to acquire a donor. And then you've already acquired a birthday fundraiser, and you don't get the data is like, as painful for an acquisition guy like me. So we worked out how to get the data from birthday fundraisers for really low cost. And so that was the start of gift one already. That's how I got there.

Julia Campbell:

I love that idea. Because the biggest piece of the puzzle here, the biggest challenge that I run into with my clients is obviously, we don't want to turn on the donate button. We don't want to turn on Facebook fundraisers, because we don't get the data. So that's what I find is so interesting about give panel, can you tell me more about exactly sort of how it works and your philosophy on how you can better acquire donors to Facebook?

Nick Burne:

Yeah, so I mean, I think I think first of all, like around data, the world is changing anyway, right? Like, there's this thing that like, you know, data isn't fundraising, right? fundraising is about people and about human beings. So our philosophy is very much a kind of, we call the H two H, right, like human to human, like fundraising is a human thing. And we work with like cancer charities, and we work with like charities that deal with like, you know, some, like baby loss, like people losing their babies, like, we'll deal with charities who are dealing with incredibly emotional things. So to reduce fundraising to data, first of all, for me is a problem or to reduce it to like, chat bots or something, right? Like, for me, that's like, I don't know, that just misses the point for me. So like, I don't see supporters as data. I see supporters as people you can have a relationship with, right. So the first thing you've got to realize with Facebook is that you can have a relationship with your fundraisers, right? Like you can have a relationship with every single fundraiser. So the organization's we work with, they have a relationship with every single Facebook fundraiser, they're able to message them, they're able to communicate with them. And so it's different, right? It's different than what you're used to as a nonprofit, you're used to kind of getting like, I don't know, a list of postal addresses, and then like doing a mail merge and sending them something, this is much more like hand to hand, this is much more like you have to communicate with them on social media, but like, it's relationships still so. So that's what we focused on was like, Okay, this person has decided to start a birthday fundraiser, which, by the way, if your listeners have ever done, that's a huge thing, it's a vulnerable thing to do. It's a big decision, you're kind of letting everyone in the world know, on Facebook, that you're supporting this organization. And so we were shocked when we looked at the data that so many of those were new to the organization, right? So you, you might be supporting a breast cancer thing, but you weren't on the breast cancer organization's database, you just chose them because they were in the list on Facebook, and you were passionate because your mom passed away with breast cancer or something, right? So essentially, we're like, the first thing we have to do is form a relationship with those fundraisers, like you can't just like leave that you have to, you have to reach out to them, you have to say thank you, you have to love them. Right. Like, and if we're not doing that, as as fundraisers and organizations, then I think there's a brand risk that right, there's a kind of like, but it's just the right thing to do, right?

Julia Campbell:

Absolutely. I completely agree. I mean, if you are donating your birthday, or any kind of milestone to an organization that you care about, you're putting yourself in this position where you're asking friends and family to support a cause you care about. And all of us fundraisers, we know how hard it is to ask for money. So I always say you should be focusing on these people that are putting themselves out there just the same way, if you ran a race, and someone was raising money to get into your race or your walk, or if they held a lemonade stand for you, or if they held some kind of fundraiser for you at their school, you would pay attention to them, and you will love on them and steward them.

Nick Burne:

Yes. So how to get them in the first place? Why would you not like work to try and when they've already done the action for you try and kind of start that like, you know, appreciate them and then start them on that supported journey. So we we really work on on that. And we developed tools that make it a lot because it's pretty hard to do it through Facebook, like you have to do it quite manually, like one by one. And we've developed some tools that just make that experience a lot easier for the nonprofit and measure kind of like measure the success of it and things like that. And so we found out that like amazingly from this new research that we did that, just by messaging a fundraiser, you actually increase their average fundraiser by 23%.

Julia Campbell:

Wow, because they feel supportive.

Nick Burne:

Right. So like, and also it legitimizes the fundraiser because it's like, you know, you've got the organization kind of stamp on it then. And so like that's like 40 like that's about on average, that's about 40 bucks, like $40 for like thank you anyway, yeah, and like so it might cost you like 40 like 40 cents to do it in terms of time, but you're getting $40 back so it's the right thing to do we say it kind of pays Thank people it pays to love on people. So it's a no brainer really to do that. So that's kind of where we started. So that's how we think about fundraising as we're like relationships. And and not getting not letting kind of data and CRM systems and stuff get in the way of like, you know, getting back to the basics of fundraising.

Julia Campbell:

But I think it's so interesting. And you've told me this before. And I've always thought, this is one of the most interesting findings is that it's new people that are doing these fundraisers. So these are brand new people coming to your organization. And, you know, what are the two things that nonprofits want more of? They want new donors, and they want younger donors. Yeah, and they want income. And it's all discretionary income that they can do anything they want with. So I really think that's fascinating that the data actually shows that the majority of people starting these kind of birthday fundraisers are brand new to the organization.

Nick Burne:

Yeah. And I think like, that's also, as we improve the supporter journey beyond Facebook, which we can talk a little bit about, that's gonna start to get less and less, because we're gonna work out how to get like, you know, how to nurture these people to do more stuff. But right now, because it's so early, a lot of them are new. So I think it's like, you know, in 10 years time, you're gonna be getting like, people that you've already kind of developed that relationship with doing more stuff for you. And so that percentage of new is gonna kind of go down.

Julia Campbell:

Yeah, let's talk about the Facebook fundraising benchmarks report. Yeah, that you recently released, people can just go to give panel calm and get the benchmarks report. So kind of, you know, blow our minds with with statistics. Powerful and, and popular is Facebook fundraising.

Nick Burne:

Yeah, it's it's, I think the first thing to say about the benchmark report just quickly is that like, there's been other benchmark reports about Facebook, but none of them have enough nonprofits that have been studied. So you know, we've got a lot of nonprofits on our platform. And obviously, Facebook, we've got the most, it goes without saying, they tend to just release kind of aggregate statistics about how well Facebook is doing. So we were able to drill down into kind of like, you know, 160 of our of our clients who were with us last year, in the year before, and really do some analysis. So it's the there's some other studies that have been done about Facebook fundraising, but I always look at how many organizations have been looked at is like, 12, or something, right? Not enough. And it's like, well, I can't really trust that data. So I think, hopefully, it's like a really trustworthy study that we've done. We commissioned an independent consultancy, to do the study so that we weren't kind of, you know, sometimes we can kind of like read our own things into it. Otherwise, our own biases. So yeah, so the, the highlights of it a couple of things. One, Facebook, fundraising is growing at 70%, we actually released that stat. And then like, the day after Facebook released their 5 billion figure. thing was the like, the growth figure of last year was exactly the same percentage. It was 70%. So we knew that we'd nailed it. So that really gave us the study credibility, I think, yeah, so 70, like, like, Jr, what other fundraising channel or strategy? Do you know that is growing 70% a year?

Julia Campbell:

I don't I see. I mean, fundraising itself is growing. But not even that that right?

Nick Burne:

Yeah, like Tesla is Amazon and Apple are not even growing 70%. Right. It's really high growth. And so what what is also interesting is looking at studies like the Blackboard, peer to peer study, which like, includes two standalone kind of platforms doesn't really include Facebook, actually reduced significantly last year, like by 40%. So what were so and they were kind of saying it was maybe to do with COVID. But I think that honestly, Facebook, fundraising and social fundraising is stunning. This is my feeling like the date, you ought to be careful about like what you read into the data. But it could be that like, social fundraising is disrupting traditional fundraising, right, as more people are doing on Facebook, they're less likely to leave Facebook and do it on kind of like, a lemonade stand in the desert, like a standalone fundraising platform.

Julia Campbell:

That's really interesting. I also I agree with that. I think it's completely disrupting traditional fundraising, I think that now people are realizing the power that they have. And they're realizing that they can make a difference and give money and raise money on the platforms where they live and breathe every day.

Nick Burne:

So I'm on Facebook, and a friend puts in like a link from another standalone platform, not Facebook, I like have this kind of thing inside as like, Oh, I can't be bothered, you know, because I got to like, but I know the Facebook wants to tax. And so I'm already started. So I think that's kind of like that. That's the dynamic that will continue to happen. And, and Facebook will continue to kind of aggregate fundraising and that's some people don't like that, but I don't think it's whether you like it or not, I think it's just the reality. It's like, it's like the music industry. I went through it with the music industry, right? Like when iTunes came out and they like it disrupted all the record labels, you can find it but you can't know you've got to get it and so I think charities have to like nonprofits have to get in and work out how to live in that new kind of paradigm rather than you know, complain about it. Yeah, whether you like it or not, it's kind of happening. So that was a good point. So it's growing growing really fast. I like I asked people I say like if you know another 100 Income channel that is growing in more than 70% can you let me know? I think it's the top one. And I don't think it's just because a COVID I think it's just growing at that rate and

Julia Campbell:

Instagram fundraising as well.

Nick Burne:

about that later it Facebook's that did include Instagram fundraising as didn't actually so is under underrated and we just had we just had our first half million dollar Instagram fundraiser from a client half a million dollars from Instagram.

Julia Campbell:

Okay, yeah, we definitely have talked about that.

Nick Burne:

Okay, cool. So that was an emergency in Palestine in Gaza. Oh, wow. Yeah. So it raised a raised a raised Well, it's still going. It's so yes, yeah. But it's not going. Yeah. So it was, um, Instagram is really starting to be exciting. So this, none of these statistics. Okay,

Julia Campbell:

let's keep going back to the benchmarks report.

Nick Burne:

Yeah. So the next thing that we saw, I'm now doing off the top of my head. But the next thing that we saw is a real shift from birthday to these Facebook challenges. So we've been working really hard in the past kind of 18 months to get this new event model kind of working on on Facebook, it was pioneered by a partner of ours in Dublin. And we've taken it to kind of the UK. And this is the big new thing, and we'll see what's great. What's great about face challenges that is different to birthday fundraising, is that the birthday funding was great, but you couldn't scale it, you couldn't like grow it. If you were gonna get like $2,000 from birthday fundraising every month, it was gonna stay that you couldn't really grow it to$10,000 a month, right? So what Facebook challenges are a model where it uses Facebook ads, and you use Facebook ads to drive people into a Facebook group to do something in a kind of community, and then start fundraisers and so we can control the scale of it. So we've been able to kind of like have really big kind of events go on. So for example, like one charity, the other day did a dog walking event and it was walk 50 miles in May, or April or whatever it was. And they raised$2.8 million.

Julia Campbell:

Oh my gosh. So these, so yeah, walk me through this, because this is something I think that is starting to take off in the US. But do you feel like in the UK, it's pretty well established? A lot of people are doing it.

Nick Burne:

Yeah, we're piloting it with we've got about 4050 us clients, and we're, we're piloting with them now. So it will be a big thing in the US. It's still very early. It's very early, like an even in the UK. It's still early. Yeah. So it's it's fantastic. Because what see the previous event model, you used to have to take people away from Facebook and get them to sign up this big long sign up for me, you know what I mean? And and then they'd have to create a fundraiser on some other platform. The great thing about Facebook challenges is, you know, you're using Facebook ads, because that's where the audience already is that you can reach. And then Facebook groups are like the best way to have online community, right? Like, like, if you were to host an online community right now, like, where would you do it? You kind of were you already do it, you know, to do your Facebook group. So like, doesn't really work on another platform

Julia Campbell:

does it? It's not as interactive. There are LinkedIn groups. There are listservs. But you know, I feel like Facebook has made it so easy with the tools to really interact with people and to monitor the group and to get some engagement. So you set up a Facebook group.

Nick Burne:

And then of course, like if people are like doing this challenge, and you're saying like, you know, set up a fundraiser for the challenge, were better place that you're not going to take them from a Facebook group and send them away to like a standalone platform when they're already in Facebook. And it's like two taps to set up a fundraiser. So really what Facebook have done with the three tools, Facebook ads, Facebook groups and Facebook fundraisers is they've unknowingly created the best fundraising platform ever to exist. And so what we did was we hack those three things together to create these amazing challenges. And there's no like 100% free setup cost for the chart like no technology costs for the charity right like and no fees, no fees for the payments, super easy to set up. You can run small ones we've had small charities be really happy to raise 20 or $30,000. Like light like for them organizational changing that amount of money for us very, very small charity like and then for large charities we've had had many so it works, whatever size of organization you are, you can try and you know you can have a go go at making it work because the setup costs are so low. I even had a local charity near me where I live in the middle of nowhere, right. And this local youth charity was going to close down during COVID. I had an eight minute conversation with them. They needed 10,000 pounds about 15,000 US dollars to keep open. They did 100k in May event and they raised like 10,000 pounds and they didn't even spend money on Facebook ads. They just got back with a new one invited them into a group to do the challenge and gotten set up Facebook fundraisers. And for them$10,000 is like their entire year's budget, right like so it works. It works really well for small organizations, but then also large organizations can really scale it like if you've got a big walk event. You've got to whatever you're going to get much lower acquisition costs go through this and much higher fundraising costs. And then you know, the difference between those two obviously is a much bigger return right for your fundraising.

Julia Campbell:

Hey, there, I'm interrupting this episode to share an absolutely free training that I created that getting nonprofits of all sizes, big results. sure you've been spending hours on social media, but what can you actually show for it? With all this posting and instagramming? and tick talking? Does it really translate into action? In my free training, I'll show you exactly how to take people from passive fans to passionate supporters. And I'll give you specific steps to create social media content that actually converts head on over to nonprofits, that convert.com. Again, that's nonprofits that convert calm, and start building a thriving social media community, for your nonprofit right now, without a big team, lots of tech overwhelm, or getting stuck on the question, What do I do next? Let me show you how it's done. I can't wait to see what you create. So what kind of challenges work? Is it mostly groups of people that are doing an athletic event? Or what kind of challenges really work? Well, yeah. And how long are the challenges run,

Nick Burne:

the best way that we found to do them, and the way that's making the most money is like to compress it to a month, so everyone in the group, so it's important that you're getting a new group together, you're not just using your existing fundraising group office, but you're getting a new group together fresh for one month, so everyone's in the same boat, everyone's doing the same challenge. There's that kind of like, really, like everyone understands it. And it's really simple. It's like, run 100k in May. So yeah, we've seen distance challenges work really well. I mean, like, so many different things. So the things that were working, well, were kind of disenchanted like 100 miles 100k, people want to get fit, but people aren't necessarily marathon runners. Right, right. And so this is these events are so open to anyone who can, who wants to do that, right, because they can do it in their own way. They don't have to, like turn up a marathon event and kind of try and win a medal, which not many of us are going to do. And so 10,000 steps a day works. Well. The Fab bet. Yeah. Fitbit, exactly. And then what happened was locked down happened. And we started to test one. So clients started and our clients innovate, right, like, they come up with the ideas, and we've got amazing agency partners that do it too. But like things that worked, we like press ups. So 100 Press ups a day challenges now 3000 subs, in a month, squats, squats have been released. So 3000 squats a day. And they all have different kind of, you know, when the communities come together and do it together it all in one group is kind of like a big sports team, and they do it together. And that they're raising money together and doing the physical challenge together, the communities are really special, there's a really special thing that happens in the groups that you kind of don't, you don't get when you're like when you go to a physical event for the day. Yes, it's totally different to have a relationship with in a group for an entire month.

Julia Campbell:

Right? That's fantastic. And it really helps build that shared identity with the organization because you're feeling like, this is something I care about. This is an incentive for me, this is an accountability group. For me, this is something fun and social that I'm doing for a month, but I'm also raising money for a cause that I care about. So it's making it fun. It's almost Hey, yes, you know, fundraising is fun. Wow, who knew?

Nick Burne:

Right? And it's, it's, it's, you said it yourself. It's about to start with, it's about the person and what they want in terms of accountability, fitness, those kinds of things. Yeah. And like most of people want to get fit, right, like they do. And, you know, this is that time to do the challenging. And you have these amazing stories of people losing weight and doing other things that had nothing to do with the charity. But then by the end of it, when you see how much is being raised for the organization, everyone kind of falls in love with the organization by the end of it. And we tend to kind of like say to say to charities, like send out a T shirt to everyone that's fundraising, you know. So by the end of it, you have all of these social media posts out there in the world, not even nothing to do with the group about people just absolutely loving on the organization and the experience that they've had. And so yeah, it's it's, it's, it's a fascinating thing to see. And like some organizations are really good at this kind of thing anyway, so when they get these kind of like the fact that they can do it on Facebook, and this way, they really kind of run with it. And it's amazing to send out medals to everyone at the end they do everything. And then we've seen some really interesting non fitness ones as well like weird skinny dipping ones and the fun ones and like baking ones and giving up stuff for a month. I love egg like really you can let your ideas run run wild, but if you wanted to kind of like make sure that you raise some money I would start with kind of like a Just a long distance event like 100k in a month event, and that's like you're, you're almost guaranteed to make a to make a profit on those kind of ones.

Julia Campbell:

And the idea is you are creating this community, and then you're giving them the tools so they can go create their own Facebook campaigns, and raise money for your organization. So I'm assuming that the nonprofit in the beginning has to do a little bit of instruction, maybe a Facebook Live maybe a video or a blog post talking about the challenge and how to participate.

Nick Burne:

Yes, it's really from the ad, we drive people straight from the ad into the Facebook group. And then in the group, you have to do a lot of work like this isn't like, this isn't no work. This is managing the community. And managing the group is like, you know, takes time. And it takes time, sometimes on the evenings and weekends. And you know, so like it does, it does take some effort. But the thing is like, actually, if you need to do a Facebook Live or some instructional video, you've overcomplicated your hook, your hook 100k. In May or walk 100k. And may, you doesn't need exit any explanation. But sometimes you see organizations come up with this clever idea that no one can understand. Now I can understand Of course, like you're not going to like from a Facebook ads, you're not going to understand like, you know, like, honestly, we've seen some crazy, crazy ones that just don't say what it actually is. It's like, it needs to be very specific. Otherwise, people come in and go, when do I have to do it? How long do I have to do it for you know, they've got all these questions. But if you answer all those by just creating something really, really, really simple. So don't miss out. Don't say like, run for refuge. Like that doesn't mean anything run out run. What run were run by an

Julia Campbell:

army fundraiser?

Nick Burne:

Yeah, like, and it's normally the ones that go wrong. Like, it's all alliteration, right. It's all clever. Maybe they've hired an agency to come up with like a really clever name. But it doesn't doesn't mean anything to anyone.

Julia Campbell:

That actually leads me to my next question. You touched on it a little bit. What are some of the other big mistakes that nonprofits make? Not even just with challenges, but when attempting to really leverage Facebook fundraisers?

Nick Burne:

Yeah, I think like the big evil one is like, Oh, you know, Facebook is just gonna, like, you know, something's going on with Facebook, and we're gonna lose all our income. And you know, there's too much risk having everything on Facebook, and then they miss the opportunity that's there. And you know, we've been doing this long enough, Julia, you know, that, like, things can't happen in waves, right? Like, nothing lasts forever. But you've got to ride the wave that's happening right now. Because that's the only way that you can ride like, so you've just got to you, what you've got to do is, you know, take the plunge, go for it, nothing's perfect. make as much headway on Facebook as you can right now. But do it in a way where you're preparing for the future, you're getting as much of that kind of that supporter journeys like that engagement with your, your, your people getting as much data and getting as much thing so you can have that relationship beyond Facebook. So we're really big on that kind of beyond Facebook piece, like, like you use Facebook backwards, yes, and having this great event, but you get people's information and engage them in such a way that you can have a multi channel relationship with them. So we kind of we want the best of Facebook, but we also want the best of like, multi channel. And I think people are like, Oh, I have to be one or the other. No, you don't. You can use Facebook for all of the best things. But just because be Facebook, want to keep people on Facebook and need to doesn't mean you have to read, we are experts at getting like the data for people so that we can engage them on an ongoing basis off Facebook, but people are like, Oh, you know, I think charities sometimes make the mistake is like one or the other. So you know, beyond Facebook strategy.

Julia Campbell:

I love that idea. That is exactly what I teach in my social media marketing Academy. And so what I teach all my clients is that, yes, social media, there's a lot of benefit in building a community. But you do have to have that longer term strategy. And I love the thought of, you know, striking while the iron is hot, like you have to be there where people are. And that doesn't mean you're going to be doing it forever. And it doesn't mean put all your eggs in that basket. And I agree with you. I think sometimes people think it's an either or situation where Facebook fundraising is a tool in your toolbox. I mean, it shouldn't replace all of your other fundraising efforts if they are working for you, you know, direct mail and multi channel. So I love that philosophy. That give panel has it sort of looking longer term, and cultivating donors and fundraisers longer term off Facebook.

Nick Burne:

Yeah. And so it's minimizing the platform risk where you can, but you're not throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Which is that an expression? Yes, it is. And that's why I see it's like, it's like, you know, it's like, oh, Facebook, or no Facebook, and it's like this, yes or no thing and it's like, no, it's like, it's, you know, we're experts, we need to be like more subtle than that. We need to understand that like, it's yes to Facebook for these things, but no, no for other things. So we, you know, we don't want to keep people on Facebook forever. That's not what good panel is about. What we actually want to do is use Facebook book to acquire supporters for you that can be with you forever. And that's it comes back to our real understanding and real passion for this human to human relationship thing. And so, yeah, Julia, is Facebook going to be around in 10 years time?

Julia Campbell:

I don't think so I don't know, don't matter, because it's a rapidly changing.

Nick Burne:

It's around this year, and I want to fundraise in 2021, I don't want to fundraising 2030, like my job targets this year, it's not necessarily to worry about if it's not going to be that. So it's like, you know, exactly.

Julia Campbell:

It's sort of like, when people choose either a CRM or an email platform or a website, you know, do I know if WordPress is going to be around in 10? years? No, but what do you know, do I know if this particular platform is going to be around? No, but I'm using it now. And I'm leveraging it to the best of my ability. And I will cross that bridge when I come to it.

Nick Burne:

Yeah. And I'm when I was getting into Facebook stuff in like, 2006, seven kind of thing. Everyone's saying face, like, it's not, you know,

Julia Campbell:

yeah, it's flash in the pan, and you're

Nick Burne:

not gonna be here in 10 years time. Well, it's still here, it's still going. So you know, you ride that wave some of those waves you you need to pick up and ride. You don't know how long they're gonna last. You don't know if they're gonna grow or recede or whatever, you just have to be on them. So like, right now you want to be like, you want to be surfing the Facebook wave fully right now. You also want to be paddling out to catch the tick tock wave. You don't want to be like surfing the tick tock wave like it's 2021. Like, you're not gonna raise like lots of money on on Tick Tock right now. But you need to kind of like be preparing for I on the horizon. Yeah. So you need to be like, you need to be smart about where you're fundraising today. Today. It's Facebook. I love that. Yeah, that's why we are and and actually it's not. It's today's Facebook, but it's very soon going to be Instagram, right. So we are like seeing that Instagram wave coming. and preparing for that as well.

Julia Campbell:

Oh, my gosh, I love that. I so we are almost out of time. I think we are out of time. But that was so quick. It does go so quick. Well, it's something we both love. And we both are really passionate about. There's so many myths and misconceptions. And there's just so much, I think bad information out there. But the philosophy, what I've always loved about you, and give panel and Harry and everyone there is just the philosophy of that, you know, don't get stressed out, just do it. Just turn these tools on, get to know them, you know, it's not the end of the world, it's not going to replace everything. And I love that idea of have your eye on the next wave, have your eye on the horizon, ride this wave, but have your eye on the next one. Because we have to do that if

Nick Burne:

we're going to be modern nonprofits, which have to do that. You've got to ride the wave and sort of have your eye out for the next one. But don't forget to ride this one. Yeah. And I think you know, there is a lot of what I call Fudd, which is fear, uncertainty and doubt, yes, it's a lot of fun around Facebook. And some of its true and some of its not true. And like a lot of the a lot of the things that aren't true are wrapped in kind of semi truths. And it's kind of like really hard to understand. But a lot of the time when there's fog around something, it's because it's working really well. And you know what I mean? And so I think you know, you've got to kind of cut through some of that, that Fudd. And that's our job. It's our job, right? Yeah, exactly. And, yeah, super, super, super interesting.

Julia Campbell:

Yay, Well, okay, so give panel has so many fantastic resources. And you have a fabulous blog that I always read a great email newsletter. So how else can people find you get in touch?

Nick Burne:

Yeah, sure. I mean, I can, I would love talking to anyone in the nonprofit sector. So anyway, I always give out my email address personally. So I'm really happy, like, again, human to human right, like, Libra and that so nicot, gift panel calm. And I answer all those emails personally. And so yeah, get in touch there, give handled as you said, groupon.com, forward slash blog, we got a ton of resources that we keep putting out trying to, you know, give back to the sector. And then you can just book a demo with our team, if you're interested in what the panel can do. The tools that can help with with with things like Facebook, Instagram, fundraising, jump on a free demo, and see see it in action. Yeah.

Julia Campbell:

And you're working with many more organizations in the US. So that's really exciting to say,

Unknown:

yeah, we've like grown. We're nearly I think you said 200 in your in your thing. And we're nearly at three. So Wow. Yeah.

Julia Campbell:

That update your bio.

Unknown:

I do. Yeah. Yeah. Things are moving quickly. But it's Yeah, it's really I mean, that's still nothing compared to the 1000s of nonprofits right there on Facebook, but we're helping one at a time. And that's, that's, that's cool for us.

Julia Campbell:

Thank you so much for being here, Nick. Hopefully, we can see each other in person at some point soon. That'd be awesome. Yeah, thanks for inviting me. Well, hey there. I wanted to say thank you for tuning in to my show, and for listening all the way to the end. If you really enjoyed today's conversation, make sure to subscribe to the show in your face. favorite podcast app, and you'll get new episodes downloaded as soon as they come out. I would love if you left me a rating or review because this tells other people that my podcast is worth listening to. And then me and my guests can reach even more earbuds and create even more impact. So that's pretty much it. I'll be back soon with a brand new episode. But until then, you can find me on Instagram at Julia Campbell seven, seven. keep changing the world. Nonprofit unicorn